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Brad Shreve:

Where did you find Queer We Are? I know you found the show on either Apple or Spotify or Overcast or any of the dozens of other podcast apps. But what's most important is you found this show smack dab in the middle of a no bitching zone. I have conversations with everyday folks, celebrities, and community leaders Sharing their stories. And while some of the challenges you see LGBTQ plus people facing today may come up, we don't stay there. Because if they come up, my guests share what they're doing about them. So each week, I give you a brief break from those troubling headlines that stay Troubling. 

So what do you do if you're a gay playwright living in the south on top of a hill with chickens In one of the reddest states in the US, Texas, and the nearest city of only a 102,000 people is 60 miles away?

The answer is obvious. You enter your script in a contest, you have multiple production companies who want to produce it, And you have it directed by a famous director, producer, and writer. Okay. Maybe that answer isn't so obvious, But it is what my guest did. Jiggs is the 1st winner of the best play submitted to the Del Shores Foundation writer search. And I was so thrilled after seeing his play, I had to have Jiggs as my guest. So let's get right to his story now. You don't have to go anywhere to do that because I'm Brad Shreve, my guest is Jiggs Burgess, and queer we are.


Brad Shreve:

Jiggs, let's talk about how we met. My husband, Maurice, and I saw your play, The Red Suitcase, at the Broadwater Theater in Los Angeles. And I believe that was the final showing there, wasn't it?

Jiggs Burgess:

That was the final show. Yeah. Came to the last one.

Brad Shreve:

It was the last one. I'm glad I caught it. When the play was over, the audience applauded the actors on the stage and with thunderous applause. And then they turned it towards you, you were hiding in the corner up in the top row. They turned and the applause became even louder. And when I saw you sitting there crying, I looked at Maurice and I said, I've gotta talk to that guy.Because you were crying and it looked like you had sheer joy on your face.

Jiggs Burgess:

You know, whenever you can Get any crowd of people. Well, first of all, to stand up and applaud those those kids, the kids. They're not kids, those people on stage. And I'm used to working with educational theaters, so everybody's a kid to me. But when when an audience does that, and it's not Force. It's not 1 person stood up and clapped, and then everybody felt like they had to. It was just automatic. And anytime That happens, and you can affect people that way.

Oh my god. That's the the one of the best things in life. It's just so and, yeah, I was crying out at pure joy just at that production. It was just amazing.

Brad Shreve:

It was an emotional roller coaster, and I wanna talk about that. But I will say this, out on the sidewalk afterwards, there were a few celebrities there. And what I love about LA is, like, he was, like, oh, look. There's so and so. And, Oh, like, there's Bradley Cooper, which he wasn't there. I wish he was, but he wasn't.

Jiggs Burgess:

I would've come out of my corner.

Brad Shreve:

But then people are like, oh, there's Bradley Cooper. And then because live in LA, it's like, okay. And then you go on about your conversation. But I did overhear some good thing quite a few good things about your play. 

Jiggs Burgess:

Oh, good. Good.Well, we got great reviews for the most part.

Brad Shreve:

Yeah. Good on you.

Jiggs Burgess:

I mean, I think there's one that was kinda iffy, but everything else was raved. 

Brad Shreve:

Well, fuck them. 

Jiggs Burgess:

Yeah. Wait. Yeah. You know, Del said they're wrong. They're just just they're wrong. And everything else was Just an absolute rave.

So that also just just blew me away. Because whenever the reviews started coming in, I was actually driving back to Texas. I'd Spent a month out in LA, for the rehearsal period, and then I had to get back because I've got an elderly mother and elderly dog, and both of them needed my attention. And so, Del called me, I was In Arizona, I don't know where the hell I was. I was out driving, and started reading that first review, and I had to pull over. Because I just did not expect it. It was so good and so, you know, just for everybody.

Brad Shreve:

Well, well deserved. Well deserved. Just so people know what we're talking about, I'm gonna have you talk about the foundation and that sort of thing. Del was here not long ago.

Jiggs Burgess:

Right.

Brad Shreve:

But some sad souls may have missed the episode. So before we get into your story, Tell us about the Del Shores Foundation and then how you got involved with it. What you know about the foundation?

Jiggs Burgess:

What what I know about the foundation is that What they do is they have this competition where there's 3 different categories. There's a, playwriting category. There's, screenwriting category, and there's a short film category. The foundation was set up so that that Del could Reach out to writers living in the South that did did not have connections to New York or LA or Chicago. And, lift them up. And that's what they're doing. I mean, it's an incredible, incredible thing that he's doing. I have been a part of the O'Neil, which is a huge thing in the play writing world, and I was a finalist.

Jiggs Burgess:

I didn't get to go to the O'Neil. But they don't do as much as Del does. I mean, he, they actually helped produce the show in LA. And, no other playwriting competition I know of does that. And it's just all out of kindness of Del's heart. Del Decided to direct for me. Del does not direct anybody's work besides his own. And he directed red suitcase, and I have another one that's that's coming up called Wounded, and he is directing that as well.

Jiggs Burgess:

And just god, that man has a heart. You don't meet many men like him. In Emerson Collins, who who is is the head of of all that in the foundation as well. And Emerson happened to be my lead, for the show. And so both of them, talented. They don't have to be as nice as they are. My god, they are. And I'm so grateful.

Jiggs Burgess:

Because I'm out here, like, as we discussed earlier, Just in the middle of nowhere. And I'm doing my best to get my workout, but without the competition, without Del Shores, then I'm still just out here on my hill writing for myself pretty much.

Brad Shreve:

And, listen, if you go to Jiggs' website, There's not a whole lot there that he tells about himself other than he's in Texas in the middle of nowhere, and he has what? 5 chickens, it says?

Jiggs Burgess:

Oh, I lost 2 to the heat right after I got back. So I've got 3 chickens, and you know, I consider, You know, chickens are just out assholes in fursuit, and, in feather suits. So but I it That made me sad. I lost them. It just got so hot here that they couldn't handle it.

Brad Shreve:

Well, I'm sorry.

Jiggs Burgess:

But I'm not I'm not rolling in eggs like I I was, but but that's just about what everybody knows about me. I've got some dogs and some chickens.

Brad Shreve:

Well and, you know, I talk to people quite frequently in Texas, and they tell me, I I live in a small town, but then you find out they're, You know, a few miles outside of Dallas or a few miles outside of Houston

Jiggs Burgess:

Right.

Brad Shreve:

That's not the case with you.

Jiggs Burgess:

No. I'm about 2 and a half hours from Dallas, About 2 hours from Fort Worth. The nearest big town is Wichita Falls, which has, a couple 100,000 people, I think. The nearest town to where I am is 6 miles away, and there's 8,000 people in Graham, which is where I went to school. And, You know, I had to bus in, got on the bus at 5 o'clock in the morning to to get there at 8. And so, yeah, I'm Not as nowhere as Texas gets, but I'm pretty nowhere. There are places out west that really get To be nowhere. There's nothing around, and I'm not that.

Jiggs Burgess:

But I'm pretty close.

Brad Shreve:

Well, when Del was on the show, he talked about the foundation that it was, For authors or writers that are in the South, and he said, you know, unlike me who left, And I'm paraphrased grossly paraphrasing here. You said something like, they stayed in to fight the fight or something like that. So I gotta ask, what the hell are you still doing in Texas?

Jiggs Burgess:

Well, I did leave for a while. I went up north to to New York City for a while, but ironically, I didn't write while I was there. It was just after well, I got through the summer of 2001. September 11th happened, and it just felt like I couldn't write after that. But when my father died, I had promised him that when the time came, even though I have 3 brothers, That I would come back and and and help with my mom. And I was just at a place where I could do that, and she was she's still pretty with it at that time. And I wanted to have that good time with her for, you know, for however long we had. And so I came back here and Good lord.

Jiggs Burgess:

When I leave, I'm gonna leave. You know, I I love my roots, but I've got I've got to get somewhere, at least to Dallas. You know? But, but that's that's what I'm doing is I'm taking care of care of family, Like a good little queer should.

Brad Shreve:

Well, you know what? When I met you for the brief moment that we talked in person, you seemed like a good person, And you just proved to me you're a good person.

Jiggs Burgess:

Well, you don't know me well enough yet.

Brad Shreve:

Now if you do decide to leave when it's time to leave Texas, if you come out to Los Angeles, be careful. Don't think you're gonna get rich right away because there's a lot of kids sleeping under, bridges who thought they were coming out to be stars?

Jiggs Burgess:

Yeah. I'm I'm old enough and wise enough to know better. But but, you know, I'll go out with whatever level of optimism I need to.

Brad Shreve:

Now you didn't just participate in this and win. You were the 1st recipient for a playwright.

Jiggs Burgess:

I was the 1st recipient. You know, going back that that story, I had a teacher who had read this, and and we have a Theater competition here in in Texas, the one act. And she wanna do the show, but she was the 1st person in Texas, The 1st school in Texas that had done Daddy's Dying. Del's play that became a movie, Daddy's Dying Who's Got the Will. And so she forwarded that play to Del. I didn't really know that. She had said something, but I didn't know how people are. I'm gonna do this, and they never do it.

Jiggs Burgess:

And a few months later, I found out he was setting up online classes through another friend. And so I contacted him, and I said, I'd like to to, take that class. Are you full? He said, well, we are. I said, Well, I think somebody sent me sent you the my place is wait just a second. I know that name. And he said, I've got your script right here. I haven't read it yet, but I will. And so he said, I think I can create another space for you in this class.

Jiggs Burgess:

Great. So I hung up, and I guess it was 2 hours later maybe. He called me, he said, oh my god, you got to submit this. I have a play writing contest. You have to submit this because I think it might win. And, I said, well, Del, I guess. And so I was preparing to enter and COVID hit, and they had to completely shut it down. And when it started back up, there we debated on whether I could enter or not, because I've been taking his classes even though We had not that that play had not originated in his class.

Jiggs Burgess:

And what he did so that I could enter As he stepped away from the contest completely, which he had not intended to do, but he stepped away so that that My play could enter. I think he had a couple people in in the screenwriting, categories too. Then I think he was as surprised as I was whenever we found that I'd won.

Brad Shreve:

Yeah. And I believe I heard Emerson in a in a interview. And Emerson Collins, as Jiggs mentioned, was the, the lead in in his play. And, I think he kinda runs the foundation, doesn't he?

Jiggs Burgess:

He's he's, I think, some the program head or he's got a title, but he basically runs the the foundation.

Brad Shreve:

But I saw him interviewed, and he said both he and Del We're not involved in the process.

Jiggs Burgess:

Yeah. Yeah. They they took themselves out. I had only Sort of met Emerson at that point. I'd used him for a couple of readings for other things that I've done, in that class. But, yeah. They both Stepped away so that there would be no conflict of interest, and we could I could enter. And I got it.

I'm so glad they did.

Brad Shreve:

So you came by it honestly?

Jiggs Burgess:

I came by it honestly. And I I'm I'm real A real kinda touchy about that because I don't know. You know, as you would be. So I had no idea if I'd Been taken out the 1st round or if I had made the finals. I think there are 5 scripts in that that final round. The instructions were there were 3 judges, finalist judges, and the instructions were that you have to be unanimous. Oh, wow. I I think 2 had me as as their top choice and one other person did not.

Jiggs Burgess:

And They went back and reread, and that person came back and said, yeah. This is it. From the story I got, and it's a good story, and I'm.

Brad Shreve:

Yeah. Don't worry about whether a story is true or not. You if if it's good, you you you hold on to it.

Jiggs Burgess:

Yeah. You gotta keep it. So and then My producer, John, Peterson from P3 Productions was one of those judges. And when it was Time, the the Del Shores Foundation gives a a a pretty good amount of money to the production the first Production company that does the show. And John reached out to me. I had a couple other people that reached out that are in the Del Shores Foundation Circle. And, John had just so much passion for the show and was so Just gung ho that I couldn't say no to having him produce it. It just it just all came about in The perfect way.

Brad Shreve:

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Let's talk about the play. 

Jiggs Burgess:

Okay. 

Brad Shreve:

I gotta tell you. It it was like a dagger in the heart, and then I'm laughing. And I love a play which has me in tears 1 minute, and then seconds later, I'm busting out laughing. And that's my favorite kind, and you did beautifully.

Jiggs Burgess:

Thank you.

Brad Shreve:

I don't know who the others were that running. They may be great, But I have no doubt the foundation chose the right person.

Jiggs Burgess:

Well, my favorite favorite review Was, and I'm gonna paraphrase here and I don't remember the name of the reviewer. I should go back. My favorite review said the opening was, Sometimes you set down at a play that has won a contest, and you think, god, how bad were those other plays? And this was not one of those times. And that is my I mean, I would some people could I was compared to Tennessee Williams and Carson McCullers and and I love that, but That was my favorite review because, yeah, we've all been there. And, so I've had I think they chose the right one. I'm I'm not gonna argue with them.

Brad Shreve:

Well, good for you. So tell the story. 

Jiggs Burgess:

you know, it's it's the story of of a man coming to terms with his his relationship with his father. I mean, it it's just really as simple as that. And I could say it's the A gay man coming to terms with his his father, his relationship with his father. But I think that I've had so much Response from the gay men and straight men saying, you know, just how much of that's universal. And we go through 40 years of this Man's life from his birth, and he was actually had a death certificate at birth. And, his accidental Awakening and to the death of his father. And sometimes it is a difficult journey because his father does not understand his son. And he's got another son that's, that is just a boy's boy and I guess in the in the world to play a favorite.

But he's the father is so obsessed with trying to make sure he's not too soft for the world. He's afraid that this child is gonna grow up and and not be tough enough. And it it it just didn't resonates for the father because of something that happened in the family when he was a child with with a brother. And, I don't wanna give that away what happened there, but Because it's part of the play, and and it's a pivotal part of the play. But but this father just doesn't know Know how to deal with his son, and the son doesn't know how to deal with his father, but no son does. And in that, we have Funny moments, and we have really hard moments. And without that humor that you're talking about, that play would just be, Oh, god. You couldn't get through it.

Mhmm. Those are some of those things that happened. So I always you know, no matter how dark the material, there's always gotta be Some humor. There's gotta be a laugh in there somewhere. And as a playwright, I know if I can get him to laugh that I've got them That I've I've got him there emotionally. In the end, you know, I think the father's redeemed. I we understand that he grows. The the lead character, Pogue, understands eventually that his father changed way before he did, But they just never really came to together until the very end.

Jiggs Burgess:

And by then, it's kinda Too late to have that relationship, which is kind of the sadness of that ending for me. You know, and that that last part, Not all of that's based on stuff that I went through. Some of it is. But that last part, I was in my father's Hospital room, the last 2 weeks of his life, I was there all night, every night. And so I had dreamt about that for 10 years. And once I wrote those last scenes with the father in the hotel in the hotel room in the hospital, then Those dreams went away. It was therapy for me. But my father was He's much more complicated than Bud is in the play.

Jiggs Burgess:

My father, he was a cowboy, but he also Enjoyed theater. He he enjoyed intellectual stuff. We sat down and read Steinbeck in a round as a kid. He'd turn he had unplugged the TV. So, yeah, he whooped us and he called it Looking for Santa Claus, which is in the play, but that's not all he was. You know, he he very much loved us and told us he loved us.

Brad Shreve:

And I wanna correct you on something you said. Or, actually, it's not a correction. I'm gonna Elaborate on something you said. You said the father didn't understand his son. He definitely didn't understand his son, but he wasn't very nice guy.

Jiggs Burgess:

No. He wasn't. No. He wasn't. The father's not you know, he, the kid's beaten. There's no other way around that. And it's hard to redeem somebody from that. And I don't know that that Bud is redeemed At the end, but he does learn.

And I think that's that's all we can ask sometimes. I don't think Bud was doing it maliciously. He's he's doing it because that's what he knows how to do. And he Doesn't know that there's a different way. I do think he loves Pogue, though.

Brad Shreve:

That was pretty clear.

Jiggs Burgess:

Yeah. Yeah. I think so. I mean, I have that there are moments in there where he he does. I just don't think he knows how to I don't know. I just he didn't know how to love. I mean, he's a lot of these things happen to him too, and so he doesn't know how to show that love at that point.

Brad Shreve:

I don't like violence, and anybody that knows that Deadpool is one of my favorite movies is probably going, what the hell are you talking about? That's cartoonish.

Jiggs Burgess:

Yeah, right. This play is not cartoonish. There's a difference. And so I'm like, I I was cringing, but like I said, then then I was relaxed, and then I was laughing. And that was cringing again.

Jiggs Burgess:

It it it's an emotional roller coaster, and I mean that in a good way. And you're right about the humor. You've got to give the audience a break somewhere.

Brad Shreve:

think Bourne Identity, I've only seen 1. I have a difficult time because it's too flashy for me as far as too much movement. I think that's one of the rare movies where there's not really any, like, a comedy break to get let people go. But You did. You handled it really well. It's it's not easy to do.

Jiggs Burgess:

Well, even even in that when when dad is dying, he has some great lines, You know about cocksuckers, and and, you know, that kind of stuff, which I just I think is hilarious. Even in our darkest moments, If we don't laugh, if we can't laugh, then what do we have to look look to? At least for me.

Brad Shreve:

Yeah.  I'll tell you. Whenever I talk to, like, a new writer, I used to be in a a group helping for beginning writers. And I would tell tell them about the needing the laugh breaks. And I and I would say, think of Steel Magnolias. The most difficult scene in the movie is at the cemetery where Sally Fields is doing this brilliant job of grieving for her daughter. And it also is the biggest laugh in the movie.

Jiggs Burgess:

Hit her. Go ahead. Hit her.

Brad Shreve:

Yeah. There you go. Hit Weezer. And it's it was beautiful. Beautifully written. You need that.

Jiggs Burgess:

Well, it's in Crimes of the Heart that way too. It's it's that laughter through through tragedy. And I think that's a pretty southern thing, though, too. We laugh a lot at funerals down here.

Brad Shreve:

And, listen, I wanna make sure you understand. We are talking about violence, but this isn't like a gore. But it's not a violent play, but the father is abusive. In in my opinion, he's abusive. And, that is shown at times. But I wanna make sure they understand this is not a

Jiggs Burgess:

Yeah. There's no blood.

Brad Shreve:

Nonstop bloody violent filled play.

Jiggs Burgess:

No. Nobody's going around, you know, putting a pickaxe in somebody's eye or anything. No. There are no chainsaws involved. 

Brad Shreve:

And I was waiting for the chainsaws.

Jiggs Burgess:

Waiting for the chainsaw. You know, it's set in Texas. You need a chainsaw mask or somewhere. Leatherface just needs to come on out. But, no. It's it's but it is hard for people. It's hard for people to sit there and watch that. I how many times people came to me afterwards and and said, you know, that was just hard. But it connected with them.

Brad Shreve:

I read one of your reviews, and it was by reviewer Steven Stanley. And what he said it is reminiscent of The World According to Garp, what but with a gay Texas swing, Jiggs Burgess' The Red Suitcase is every bit as touching and uplifting as it is entertaining. Del Shores himself couldn't have written it better. 

First of all, I didn't read it because it's a damn good review, but that's a damn good review.

Jiggs Burgess:

It's a damn good review. And I just, I wanna cry. It just it's it's hard for me to believe that those reviews were like that. Go ahead. Sorry.

Brad Shreve:

It jumped out at me because The World According to Garp, I think, is grossly underrated. I loved the book, and I loved the movie. It's one of those where I loved them both equally. There there's a little difference in each one of them, but I absolutely love that movie. And I heard Robin Williams interviewed, and he said it was one of his favorite that he was in because he loved Garp. And the reason Garp was one of his favorite characters he played was no matter what the world threw at him, he kept going.

Jiggs Burgess:

Yeah.

Brad Shreve:

Now that was true of Pogue in your play. Is that true of you?

Jiggs Burgess:

I break down. I you have to keep going, But I I break down more often than Pogue did. I bitch a lot more than Pogue did. But, I guess. I don't know. You you just hit snags and you gotta keep pushing. One of the ways that Hogue and I are very much the same as our closest to our grandparents, our grandmother. You'd say something about her age and said, there's only 1 other alternative.

Jiggs Burgess:

And and that's the same with pushing through. There's You either give up and you just lay down and or you live. You gotta push through. And I think Pogue is the idealized kinda me in that. I don't I don't push through as well as he did.

Brad Shreve:

But, you know, some people choose to live, but they ended up not living well. They're miserable. And Pogue, and I'm thinking you, stay above it all Even when it's difficult.

Jiggs Burgess:

Well, I think Pogue does. I I don't know that I always stay above it all. I will say that I've had Good friends that have taught me how to live, when I didn't think that I knew how. I had a a a a friend, his name was Dean Thompson, and And he passed away recently. But the man knew how to live life. Whether it was for his kids, or his wife, or for, You know, friends. I used to teach dyslexic kids. I was a private tutor, and I I worked with Davis, which Dean's son for 10 years, 15 years almost.

And he took me into his family, and he showed me kinda how to do that, how to live, You know, how to be good to people, and how to offer the treat family, which I didn't know necessarily how to do. And, in other people, I had I've had lots of people around me who did that. I've been very lucky in that I've drawn people around me That that do that. Help me do that. What do you do otherwise? I just don't know anymore what you do otherwise. And you're right. There are people who Just don't let live well.

Brad Shreve:

You mentioned of having a friend, and I'm sure you have many friends. But it made me think about where you live. You live on a hill in Texas where the winds blow. 

Jiggs Burgess:

Yep.

Brad Shreve:

You now have 3 chickens.

Jiggs Burgess:

I have 3. Not 5 anymore.

Brad Shreve:

And the biggest town is 8,000 people, Biggest nearby town.

Jiggs Burgess:

Right

Brad Shreve:

What was it like growing up as a gay kid gay man in that area?

Jiggs Burgess:

I don't know. I didn't know any different. I if there was anybody if there's anything to the nurture theory to things, I would be straight as a board. I was on a horse before I could ride. I was at rodeos. I was on a tractor. Now my oldest brother had to be An adult pursuit the moment he he arrived on Earth, but but we all were just in that West Texas I don't know. Can you hear the chicken?

Brad Shreve:

Yes. I can. I don't know if the listener can, but I can hear it.

Jiggs Burgess:

She just laid her egg, and she's telling me.

Brad Shreve:

Life in West Texas.

Jiggs Burgess:

A life in West Texas. But we spend our summers at rodeos.

Brad Shreve:

No. I have to stop you here. You're talking about men on tractors and rodeos. No wonder you're gay.

Jiggs Burgess:

Well, my first my you know, I I knew the the day I was born, I knew I was queer. And, I I don't know how I knew it, but my first crush was a rodeo clown.

Brad Shreve:

Oh, well, you know That gave me the creeps. Guys in rodeo sound how the clowns freaked me out. Well, you know, he But tell the story. I wanna hear it.

Jiggs Burgess:

Well, the I just we went to those rodeos dad. My dad did a lot of things to make money. And one of the things he did was he he he helped, they call it a a rough stock producer, which, you know, the bucking horses and the And the bulls and and all that kind of stuff, you you load them on a, you know, trailer and you take them to where the rodeo is. And We used to go, God, all over West Texas. These little places like Guthrie and Floydada, and things that you've never heard of. Places you've never heard of. The week there was a kid, I thought he was grown up, but he was 18 or 19. He was a rodeo clown and he did a lot of those rodeos as well.

Jiggs Burgess:

And Yeah. First of all, he was nice to me.And and that helped. But he used me in some of his bits. All rodeo clouds have a certain bits, and they they need a mark or whatever. And I was probably 4th grade, and I just fell in love. And it's the 1st man that I sought out to see naked.

Brad Shreve:

Mhmm.

Jiggs Burgess:

And, it would you know, this is rodeo kind of circuit. We All, like, bathed in sock ponds and things like that when we didn't have a hotel or motel, in which wasn't that often that we had a motel. Well, I knew I was gay before that, but

Brad Shreve:

That sealed the deal.

Jiggs Burgess:

Yeah. That sealed the deal. And he wasn't in makeup at the time.

Brad Shreve:

So Okay. Good.

Jiggs Burgess:

Well, he was out of clown clown makeup. But yeah. And he's also the 1st person I knew that didn't wear underwear. I don't know why I remember that. But Well,

Brad Shreve:

of course, you remember that. I can tell you why you remember it.

Jiggs Burgess:

But, you know, we we had a what would Be considered a really straight upbringing. And and so and we were exposed to sex early on. If you're On a farm or ranch or you know, we had horses, and we had a stud horse. We had mares, and we'd hire out the stud horse. And so I knew what Sex was an early age, and it was the seventies. So there was playboys all around and hustlers and We Magazine and, you know, mama even had a Had a Playboy or 2 and under her mattress, and she would kill me if I she knew I I said that. But it was it was the seventies. We were we were Exposed to that, and my brothers went straight to the playboys and the things with women.

Jiggs Burgess:

And I was like, okay. Hustler has some pretty good looking man. Mhmm. They had some some really great models. So did I guess I was trying to Well, I do know that I did go into the penthouses and the playboys and tried to make myself straight. I tried so hard to make myself straight because, you know, well, it just you weren't supposed to be gay, you know, especially small town. But that didn't work, but I could I could I could get those hustlers and and the We Magazine, and I could I could pretend I was looking at the the women. And they had oh god.

Jiggs Burgess:

They had some good looking guys or at least in my 

Brad Shreve:

Thank god for hustle because Playboy had guys in it from time to time, and they were pretty the Hustler had guys almost every episode, in every issue. So, yeah, I did the same thing. I bought it because, you know, I'm a straight guy, so I'm gonna buy hustler. Well, were there women in that magazine?

Jiggs Burgess:

Yeah. Well, there there were apparently. But, yeah, I just you gotta do what you do. And, you know, Penthouse had the forum, and so I was a literate Child, I read the forum. And, you know, there was always some kind of, you know, not outright gay Something going on. There was something that was pretty home erotic in those in those letters. I have friends that say I didn't know until Such and such age. And I just thought think, oh, God.

I knew. I knew. And I think ever I didn't have it coming out in my family because I think everybody just knew. And so I had friends that didn't know. And whenever I said something, they just said, oh, that makes sense. Dad never said anything to me about it. I know he had, one of my friends' dads Called my father at one point in high school and and told my dad, your son needs to quit Hanging out with my my son because he's making him gay. And now this child, I didn't have to do any pushing in that direction.

And so but I didn't learn that until Much, much later, he didn't come to me. And now he showed his disapproval in lots of different ways, but but he never did Bad mouth me to my my face anyway. He didn't do what a lot of parents would have done in that. And so I was lucky in that way. You know, I think mom had a harder time with it than he did. As a matter of fact, mom wanted a girl so bad. Yeah. I was number 3, and she the la the la well, she has 4 boys, and the last 3, she was trying for a girl.

And I just at one time at one point, I said, you could have stopped with me. You had me. You didn't you didn't meet the little brother. You try again. But anyway, that's that's kinda what my experience and I was also lucky because We are old family here. We're not old money. We don't have money, but we've we've had land here forever since before the civil war, and, You know? And that gives you a certain leeway in a small town, in a small Texas town anyway. And so and I was also a little bit bigger than than the other boys so I could fight.

And so I didn't Get a lot of that stuff. The the most the the kind of, bullying and bashing, all that came from My brothers. The 1st person to call me call me a a a queer was my grandfather. My brothers followed suit with with, you know, queer and faggot and all those words. That and you really don't know what they mean, but you know they're bad. You know they're bad just by the way people say them. So I had that within the family, but I didn't have it necessarily within the community. Either I didn't have it or I was just too naive to see it.

Brad Shreve:

So what's the future of the red suitcase and the future of Jiggs Burgis?

Jiggs Burgess:

The red suitcase, I don't know quite yet. We're we're hoping for some some more productions, and I'm hoping to have, Well, Del's pushing a lot of things. So Del pushes, then things happen. I'd love to see it done in Dallas, Because I think it's a it's a great show for Dallas. So it it has a future. I just don't know what it is. You know, it's it's a tough play to produce, Because it's a rather large cast for what theater's going through right now. Theater's really going through a contraction period, and They want shows with 2 or 3 characters or, you know, some very small cast, and it's got a large cast.

Jiggs Burgess:

And the subject matter is not exactly Something that you'd find at a community theater. So Yeah. We're gonna have to find these great regional theaters and and and professional theaters that that want to do it. And John at p 3 is also just pushing for that. And at the same time, a little show I John produced for fringe, for Hollywood fringe called Wounded is actually just the 2nd act of a whole play called Wounded, but it The 2nd act is called Wounded. It's 2 plays that are 1 night of entertainment, kind of. Each act can stand on its own as a play. And, so they did the 2nd act, Wounded.

Jiggs Burgess:

And, it won all kinds of awards, and I had to had a lot of stuff out of it because it it was too long. But it won the international Fringe Encore Award. What usually happens, it's that's out of out of New York, so we'll have a off Broadway run of wounded coming up in January January to February. What these, encore series you usually do, they they pull shows from the fringes all over the world, And I think he said he'd been to 5 continents by the time he got to Hollywood. And they pull shows to nominate. They don't send people right to the to the festival. And when they were announcing all the shows that they nominated out of the Fringe, he Gave them all their little awards, and then he said, well, there's 1 show that we are going to invite Right away, we we got the funding. We're just gonna tell them that they're coming, and that's wounded by just purchase.


And so my My future's pretty good. I've got a off Broadway show that's going up directed by Del Shores. I say I had no no shows, No connections, but I have connections in educational theater. And so I've got a lot of shows being done. I think I've got 50 productions right now in the state of Texas alone, and Others around the country. And so I'm just gonna keep writing. And if people wanna see it and wanna hear it, then I'll just be happy as I can be.

Brad Shreve:

I look forward to the future of Jiggs Burgess because I know I'm gonna be seeing more of you down the road. I have no doubt whatsoever. 

Jiggs Burgess:

Thank you. 

Brad Shreve:

I am glad I approached that humble man up in the corner of the theater, and I wanna thank you for being my guest. It's been delightful.

Jiggs Burgess:

I wanna thank you because because this has been so much fun for me. I didn't know what to expect. I just But, it's been so much fun, like talking to old friend.

Brad Shreve:

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